522. Germs Don't Cause Disease: Unmasking Contagion & Virology Myths w/ Dr. Andrew Kaufman

Andrew Kaufman

DISCLAIMER: This podcast is presented for educational and exploratory purposes only. Published content is not intended to be used for diagnosing or treating any illness. Those responsible for this show disclaim responsibility for any possible adverse effects from the use of information presented by Luke or his guests. Please consult with your healthcare provider before using any products referenced. This podcast may contain paid endorsements for products or services.

Join me and Dr. Andrew Kaufman, an unconventional MD and COVID-19 whistleblower, as we explore the pitfalls of psychiatric medicine and misinformation during the COVID era while shedding light on the flaws in virology, PCR tests, and the effectiveness of masks.

Andrew Kaufman, MD is a public speaker, researcher, natural healing practitioner, business and homeschooling consultant, inventor, and COVID-19 whistleblower. He has a BS from MIT in Molecular Biology and completed his psychiatric training at Duke University Medical Center after graduating from the Medical University of South Carolina. He spent many years in the medical field and practiced as a forensic psychiatrist and expert witness.

When he learned that many of the modern medical practices were harming people and not helping them, he gave up his lucrative medical career and began researching and understanding the relationship between body, mind, and spirit, and how to use nature to heal your own body. His new practice is spreading truth about the world we live in today and fighting for freedom. He teaches people the vital knowledge that they need to implement true care for themselves and their families at the highest level of consciousness. He now teaches people how to become their own health authority.

DISCLAIMER: This podcast is presented for educational and exploratory purposes only. Published content is not intended to be used for diagnosing or treating any illness. Those responsible for this show disclaim responsibility for any possible adverse effects from the use of information presented by Luke or his guests. Please consult with your healthcare provider before using any products referenced. This podcast may contain paid endorsements for products or services.

Join me and Andrew Kaufman, MD on a journey towards enlightenment and empowerment in our health and well-being. This man is not your average doctor. He's a public speaker, researcher, natural healing practitioner, and, importantly, a COVID-19 whistleblower. 

With a foundation in molecular biology from MIT and psychiatric training from Duke University, Dr. Kaufman brings a wealth of knowledge and an unconventional perspective that challenges the status quo of modern medicine.

In this episode, Andy shares his transformative journey from a forensic psychiatrist to becoming a pioneer in natural healing. He opens up about the moment he realized that traditional medical practices were often causing more harm than good. This revelation led him to abandon his lucrative career and focus on a holistic understanding of health, integrating body, mind, and spirit.

His mission now? Empowering individuals to become their own health authorities, armed with knowledge and awareness to implement true self-care at the highest level of consciousness.

Our conversation takes a deep dive into some controversial yet crucial topics. Andy provides a thought-provoking analysis of the dangers associated with psychiatric medicine, including antidepressants and sleeping pills. His insights are backed by science and personal experience, offering a fresh perspective on mental health treatment. 

We also explore the contentious subjects of germ theory, COVID-19, and HIV/AIDS. Andy's research challenges conventional narratives, shedding light on the flaws in virology, PCR tests, and the effectiveness of masks.

Throughout this episode, we tackle some big questions… What is the real story behind the contagion myths of COVID and HIV? How do bioweapon and HIV conspiracy theories hold up under scrutiny? And perhaps most importantly… How can we discern the truth amidst a sea of misinformation? 

Dr. Kaufman's expertise in these areas is not just academic; it's a call to action for all of us to re-examine what we've been told and take control of our health in a more informed, holistic way.

(00:00:09) A Biologically Approved Diet for Our Pets

  • Dehydrated versus raw foods for dogs and cats
  • Pottinger cat study
  • How long dogs could live if they eat raw food

(00:04:08) The Dangers of Psychiatric Drugs

  • Andy’s career journey from traditional physician to functional nutritionist
  • Read: A Mind of Your Own by Dr. Kelly Brogan 
  • The truth about recovering from psychiatric illness 
  • Luke’s experience on Effexor
  • The real issues with psychiatric drugs

(00:17:04) The Correlation Between Antidepressants & Suicide

  • Most common experiences on antidepressants and why they don’t work
  • The link between antidepressants and suicidal thoughts in children/teenagers
  • Akathisia: the dangerous side effects of psychiatric medicine

(00:31:15) Andy’s Research on Virology & Germ Theory

(00:44:11) Dispelling the Contagion Myth of Covid & HIV

  • Why people got sick during the Covid era
  • Did the Covid virus really exist? 
  • Diving into the research studies that provided a basis for viruses
  • How the vaccine could’ve caused life threatening illness 
  • The various conditions that led to the HIV crisis 

(01:09:56) Addressing the Bioweapon & HIV Conspiracy Theories 

(01:21:51) An Overview of Lab Culture Experiments & PCR Testing Flaws

  • What are typical blood tests looking for?
  • How cell culture experiments work
  • How the CDC confirmed the PCR test
  • The politics behind approval for diagnostic tests in an emergency

(01:36:48) The Research Proving Masks Are More Harmful Than Helpful

  • Why masks don’t actually help you prevent contracting a virus
  • Discussing the Cochran collaborative research studies
  • Dangers of microplastics and their link to disease

[00:00:00] Luke: What's the difference between feeding your dog dehydrated liver and raw liver, Andy?

[00:00:10] Andy: Well, certainly there's less water in the dehydrated version. But I think we should look at the Pottenger cat study to learn and inform ourselves about this. And Pottenger is often talked about in the same vein as Weston A. Price, and there's the Price-Pottenger Foundation. But Pottenger was a physician that independently did some very fascinating research with cats. And this was in the late 1940s, early 1950s, and he had two groups of cats. And the healthy control cats were fed a diet of raw meat and raw dairy, which is what approximates what they would eat in nature.

[00:00:51] But in the experimental group of cats, he gave them cooked food and pasteurized dairy. And what happened is, and I'm in the midst of reading, there's actually a book that describes all these experiments in detail. And I'm just at the beginning of this, but essentially what happened is that the cats that were fed cooked food and pasteurized dairy, the first generation, they started having health problems. The second generation, so their offspring, had worse health problems. And the third generation was 100% stillborn.

[00:01:28] Luke: Wow.

[00:01:29] Andy: So in three generations, essentially they were becoming extinct from eating cooked and pasteurized food. And then they gave the second generation, put them on the raw diet, and it took three generations before they fully recovered their health compared to the control group.

[00:01:47] Luke: Interesting.

[00:01:48] Andy: So I think it's pretty safe to at least extend this to some other animals, like pets, like dogs, that you might find similar results if you did that because humans are the only ones that have cooked or processed food in their diet. And may be distinct because the digestive system, for example, of humans is different from dogs and cats.

[00:02:15] So I'm not sure how to generalize this information to humans, but it certainly is worth considering, the benefits of eating raw. But in terms of our pets, I think it's critical that they eat a raw diet. In fact, based on some historical information, it's most likely that our pets would live much, much longer than we expect if they were eating a species appropriate diet.

[00:02:44] So like dogs might actually live 25 to 30 years rather than 10 to 15 years, which we all observe with the lifestyle that we use to take care of pets, feeding them processed kibble and things like that. And of course, subject them to a lot of vaccines.

[00:03:00] Luke: Yeah. Well, I'm glad I intuitively started feeding my dog raw food exclusively, I think probably shortly after I got her. She was my first dog. One thing I didn't know, though, because I never had dogs growing up or anything, I had a couple of cats when I was a kid. When my dog was about five, I think she's seven or eight now or something, never really sure because she was a rescue. She rescued me, actually. That's another story.

[00:03:27] Andy: Many of us have been rescued by dogs.

[00:03:29] Luke: Yeah. But then someone, I don't know, when she was around five, said, how old is she? I said, five. She said, oh, wow, you got another maybe 10 years. And I said, what? And they go, yeah, dogs die when they're like 15. I had no idea. I just figured, well, they just as long as you live, almost.

[00:03:43] Yeah, so now I'm always thinking, oh man, another year has gone by. I'm really counting down. I don't have expectations of her dying at any point, but it was just funny. I was so naive. I didn't understand at all that dogs have a finite lifespan, but maybe less so feeding them a biologically appropriate diet.

[00:04:03] Andy: Absolutely.

[00:04:04] Luke: Cool, cool. Before we dive in here for people that don't know you and your work, give us a truncated elevator introduction to where you came from and where you are now.

[00:04:18] Andy: I guess I'm a recovering physician, you could say. So I started off my career in psychiatry and forensic psychiatry and was involved in working with patients in some unusual settings like in jails, and also did a lot of expert witness work and research. I was an academic physician at the beginning of my career.

[00:04:40] And over time through my personal experience and through reading the research literature, I began to realize that psychiatric drugs at first, because that was in my specialty, not only were not actually effective, but actually responsible for causing quite significant harm, including dying sooner than necessary from taking psychiatric drugs and multiple classes of psychiatric drugs.

[00:05:11] And this led me on a path first to be much more conservative in my prescribing practices and eventually just taking all patients off medicines. And then I started to discover other methods, and early on I came-- actually, a friend, a spiritual fellow of mine, that we were doing spiritual work together, recommended Kelly Brogan's book.

[00:05:38] And we had a lot in common because she was a psychiatrist as well, and in the first half of her book, A Mind of Your Own, she critically analyzed all of the clinical research on psychiatric drugs, especially antidepressants. And her findings matched exactly with what I found in my own review of the same literature, but then she introduced another way of healing based mostly on nutrition. And this was quite foreign to me, although I knew nutrition was important.

[00:06:12] In fact, I had been independently studying nutrition for a number of years and originally reading authors like Dean Ornish with ultra low fat diet, and then studying some other people like Robert Lustig, who talked about the dangers of sugar and metabolic disease. And I had experimented with different diets, including some extreme ones, just as a physician interested in nutrition trying to find what's the healthiest diet.

[00:06:44] Although I never thought about using it as a treatment, I thought really for my family's health, I wanted to have optimum nutrition. But this approach that Kelly wrote about was really a paradigm shifting for me, and I had the occasion where a former colleague of mine, a social worker and therapist, was struggling with her own anxiety issues and asked me, could you recommend a psychiatrist?

[00:07:14] But I knew that she'd already been to psychiatrists and she'd been to cardiologists and endocrinologists and every kind of doctor to try and figure out how to reverse this condition and was never successful. So I said, hey, do you want to try something different? And I said, I'm going to do it with you.

[00:07:33] I thought if I was going to recommend someone do this, I want to see what it's like myself. And so she decided to give it a chance and we both did this 30-day elimination diet, and she experienced complete remission of her anxiety issues in just a couple of weeks.

[00:07:53] And I actually had improvement in my health, even though I didn't have any psychological issues, but I had been taking medicine for heartburn and reflux for 20 years, and it just seemed to disappear just doing this elimination diet for 30 days. And this really blew me away.

[00:08:18] And so I began to embark upon an independent study program for the next three years where I learned everything I could about natural healing. And this information wasn't out there in an organized manner where you can get a textbook and go through everything step by step. I had to piecemeal it together from a variety of sources and practitioners and anecdotal information and led me to understand really the paradigm of nature healing and especially toxemia of disease.

[00:08:53] Luke: Cool, cool. Well, I'm glad you left the dark side.

[00:08:58] Andy: Yeah. Well, in early COVID, I was speaking out and then I was asked to put on a mask. And aside from the fact that masks are only harmful and don't benefit our health in any way, think about if you're talking to a teenager who's been heavily traumatized and can't trust adults or the system and they're very vulnerable and you're trying to reach them and get to know them.

[00:09:28] You're doing this, but you're covering your face. It's like they could think that you're laughing at them because people do sometimes laugh at them at their predicament. And there's no way you can have appropriate trust. And when they tried to impose that on me, I said, I can't do my job that way.

[00:09:48] And they pushed me off. They terminated my contract. They actually violated the contract in doing that, but I didn't put up a fight because I knew that I could not really do the right thing for the patients in the constraints of that system, even though I had been trying already for over a year. So it was a welcome transition.

[00:10:11] It was very risky because I had no way to support myself when I exited that system, but it's been just extremely rewarding because the people who I work with, they're motivated. They want to solve their own problems. They're not just wanting you to fix everything. That was a major problem in psychiatry aside from the drugs, is that all the patients had the attitude that their problem was due to something beyond their control.

[00:10:41] There was a disturbance in their brain chemistry or they had bad genes or something like that. And how would you as an individual fix that? You can't tweak your own genes or change your chemistry. You need to rely on a chemist or a professional to address that problem. And that makes you dependent.

[00:11:02] But the truth is that the problems that people struggle with that we would term psychiatric illness, in order to recover from those, you need substantial effort from the individual. They have to consciously try to change their patterns of how they see the world, how they interact with people, how they experience life in order to change their experience. And it can't just be someone else doing all of it for them.

[00:11:36] Luke: Excellent. Yeah, I had a terrible experience with antidepressants many years ago. It's just, oh man, one of the darkest times of my life, actually. And I wonder sometimes what it was about. It was something called Effexor, and, a, it was extremely addictive. And I had just, yeah, maybe a year or two before gotten sober.

[00:12:06] And wasn't interested in being addicted to anything, and I was very familiar with that dynamic, that relationship between myself and something outside of myself, and I became really dependent on it. And yeah, it was really difficult to come off it, but I wonder sometimes with those medications how much of it is the interference of the brain chemistry and how much of it is the fluoride or whatever they're putting in the damn medicine. What do you think it is about them that are, by and large, so counterproductive if not destructive?

[00:12:41] Andy: Everything that we're told about how they work, that they increase serotonin or inhibit the reuptake of serotonin receptors, that's not really based on a sound scientific research. It's really more of a theoretical construct. Even in the mainstream, everyone would admit, we don't really have an understanding of how those information systems in our brain work.

[00:13:10] So in order to determine what's going on, we just have to observe the effects that these things have on people, but we can't relate that necessarily to the specific substances in as much as the mechanisms, but we can just correlate. We know when we take these drugs, most people have this effect.

[00:13:35] And you bring up a good point. It may not be common with that particular drug that you mentioned, but there are many psychiatric drugs that have a street value as intoxicants that people would abuse. And in fact, in the prison system in New York, they were very concerned about this, and they actually made it next to impossible to prescribe certain drugs, even though some of the same drugs that may be people would abuse or used to get high could, for a temporary situation, be life saving.

[00:14:07] For example, when people are getting sober off of alcohol particularly, they can get so sick that they could even die. And I've had many patients in intensive care because they just quit drinking and went into this delirium state and had problems with heart arrhythmias, all kinds of things, and taking a drug to substitute for the alcohol temporarily, but tapering it so the body can adapt to the change and not go haywire like that.

[00:14:40] Those are the drugs that were the hardest ones to prescribe in a correctional setting, for example. And that meant that many people who are arrested and then no longer had access to alcohol, for example, they had to suffer, and there was very risky stuff going on in many of those situations. And the same thing is true with the psychiatric drugs, that many of them have withdrawal symptoms when people stop taking it.

[00:15:09] And that's part of why they maintain dependence on it, because it's so difficult to come off the drugs. But they get sick physically that they go back on it. But really with antidepressants, what I've observed to be the most common experiences is essentially that their expression and experience of emotions is blunted.

[00:15:33] So they go from being frustrated, anxious, sad, lonely, to much less of those things, almost to a point of apathy where they might acknowledge that, oh, my life is miserable, but I just don't care so much anymore. I'm just going to sluggishly go about my activities.

[00:15:56] And that can be seen sometimes misinterpreted as being beneficial, but it takes away the person's ability to actually address what's going on because many times when people are in that state, it's a result of they're in an abusive relationship, or they can't get a job, or their marriage is toxic.

[00:16:27] And when you're walking around and just going through the motions and not really feeling your feelings, you're not going to be able to effectively repair or address any of those situations. So it delays or prevents you from actually recovering from the problem in the first place and just perpetuates it that you go in this blunted state of being where you're apathetic and everything just lingers in a poor state of affairs.

[00:17:00] In addition to that, you have some directly harmful effects of these drugs that are a little bit less common, but quite more common than you think. And some of these things are almost hard to believe at first. So when I was in my residency training, the FDA issued what's called a black box warning, which is one step away from pulling a drug, taking it off the market because it's too dangerous.

[00:17:27] But the black box warning is a warning to prescribers, doctors, that this drug has some serious risks and you better be very careful with it. And it was about all antidepressants in children, that it could cause-- and it was worded strangely-- suicidal behavior. So I was in my training, like I said, at Duke when this came out, and the supervisors basically told us, now wait a minute.

[00:17:59] These drugs don't cause this. Kids have suicidal behaviors because depression causes suicidal behaviors. But the thing is that in the control groups in the studies, they didn't have this, so they were missing. They were just justifying what they do, which is prescribe antidepressants for everyone.

[00:18:18] But they told us that in order to protect ourselves from liability, because it's possible that we could see someone, give them a prescription for a drug, and then they could attempt or even complete suicide-- and this happens anyway when you're working with folks like this, rarely, but it does happen.

[00:18:37] And so they said, oh, well, in order to not get sued for that, if it happens-- they weren't concerned about preventing that. They were concerned about us not getting in trouble for it. They said that we should call any patient that we start antidepressants a few days later and check in and make sure they're not suicidal. And that was the end of the discussion about it.

[00:19:04] But fast forward to several years later when I was working in a facility with troubled teenagers and I had a lot of teenage girls who were my patients that were prescribed antidepressants, many of them came to the facility, they were taking these drugs, and they were telling me that every single day they were thinking about suicide.

[00:19:29] And that's not something that you want to hear from your patient. You want them to not think about suicide at all because their life is better. So I was very concerned about this, but I said to myself, they were on antidepressants, which are supposed to help, but they're still thinking about suicide every day.

[00:19:46] So this drug is clearly not working. I didn't suspect at the time that it may have been causing the suicidal thoughts because I thought to myself, how could a drug cause you to have a thought? It didn't add up for me. But since I determined that the drugs couldn't be working, I started tapering the patients off the antidepressant.

[00:20:10] And the first time this happened, the second time, the third time, and just about every single time I encountered this situation, maybe with a dozen different girls, every time when I stopped the medicine, within a couple of weeks, they stopped having suicidal thoughts. And I started to ask them, I said, when did you start developing these daily suicidal thoughts?

[00:20:35] And I was able to correlate that in many of the situations to right after they started taking the antidepressant. So I was now seeing that this was a real effect, and that the black box warning was actually very justified. In fact, they should have taken it off the market. Because you can clearly see from the research that people who have more thoughts about suicide have more suicide attempts and are more likely to die from suicide.

[00:21:02] They may have worded it that way to make it sound less serious, but more suicide thoughts equates to more actual suicide. So we're saying that these drugs actually cause suicide in some of these patients and yet they're still being prescribed every day to people even with very mild issues or issues that couldn't possibly-- if your wife leaves you and you get sad, how could a pill fix that problem?

[00:21:34] Wouldn't you have to go through grief and healing and then maybe find a new partner and then that's how you would heal? Not by taking a pill, right? And by that reasoning, you might as well just start drinking, get drunk all the time, so you forget about your problems. And I think what they actually do in psychiatry is pretty close to that strategy. In fact, if you look back at Sigmund Freud, known as the father of psychiatry, what did he do and recommend? Cocaine. Cocaine is the best antidepressant.

[00:22:10] Luke: Wow. I didn't know that. That's funny. Well, if we're able to quantify suicidality, at least in those broad terms, it brings to mind for me people becoming not only suicidal, but in some cases, homicidal. And we look at these school shootings and when they began. They began decades, if not centuries after people had access to firearms.

[00:22:45] There seems to be a possible correlation between the introduction of these so-called medications and disturbed people and disturbed kids in particular going off the rails and not only harming themselves, but usually harming a number of other people and then harming themselves.

[00:23:05] Andy: Well, this is a little bit trickier to look at because I think in many of those incidents, what we're told happened is not actually what happened.

[00:23:16] Luke: Yeah, that's the problem in dissecting these things because we're seeing these events through the filter of the media and we now, thankfully, know that the media is largely untrustworthy.

[00:23:25] Andy: But I can definitely tell you from work because a lot of the patients I worked with had severe mental illness and a lot of them were in criminal justice settings. So these were folks that had violent tendencies. And people with severe mental illness are not more dangerous than other people.

[00:23:47] In fact, some cases they may be less dangerous because they're not as capable of planning a dastardly scheme because they're more disorganized. And they're actually more likely to be victims of violence than people without mental illness. So it's a difficult plight, and I don't want to put down the mentally ill or say that give the impression that they're dangerous.

[00:24:08] But, of course, just like there is a section of the non-mentally ill population who are dangerous and engage in violent activities, there are some within. And I think the strongest factor that increases that behavior is actually a drug addiction. That's what I've observed.

[00:24:27] But there is a particular side effect of many psychiatric drugs in the class that are known as anti-psychotics. And this includes drugs you may have heard of, like Seroquel, Zyprexa, Abilify, as well as some older drugs like Haldol and Prolixin. And psychiatrists are taught about some of these side effects, but they're not very good at observing for them because doctors tend to have this cultural attitude that whatever problem their patient has, they didn't cause it.

[00:25:03] But in truth, medicine causes quite a number of problems. And in psychiatry, we know that these drugs cause side effects. In fact, sometimes many psychiatrists, when they prescribe some of these drugs, they will give a second drug to mitigate or prevent the side effects. But there's one side effect that is more difficult to assess, and it really does not respond to treatment with another drug, and it's called akathisia.

[00:25:31] And I'm going to describe it to you because it could be considered a form of torture because what you experience, and it might be a little bit similar to what lay people know is restless leg syndrome, but it doesn't just occur when you're trying to sleep. And it's a feeling of uneasiness in your body that you can't get your body into a comfortable neutral position like that.

[00:25:57] Imagine writhing around in your seat, you have wet clothes on, and you're super uncomfortable. And no matter what you do, it's just there. You feel uneasy, not right in some way. And they would feel like that all the time. In fact, many times they would misinterpret this experience as a worsening of the mental illness.

[00:26:19] And many times people would get this side effect when they were prescribed this drug as a sleeping pill by a family doctor because these drugs are prescribed as sleeping pills more than they're prescribed for actual psychiatric patients. And the primary care doctors have no idea what akathisia is because they're not trained on these drugs because they don't have any psychiatric training, even though they manage probably 90% of psychiatric issues among the population because they're accessible.

[00:26:51] Psychiatrists are hard to find in many places. So I've seen people come to the emergency department thinking they're having a psychiatric crisis, but they're just having the side effect. And when you feel this way, you could imagine that you could get quite irritable and lash out. And with patients who have a tendency to be violent and very difficult interpersonally and aggressive, this brings it out in them.

[00:27:21] And so I think that is a very insidious and dangerous way that some of these drugs can increase the violent tendencies of the patients who are taking them. But I have not seen evidence that someone who is not violent would be given a psychiatric drug and turn into a violent-behaving person. I don't think that's exactly how it would work.

[00:27:51] Luke: Thanks for clarifying that. These thought memes of fake news permeate both sides of our reality. You have the mainstream media narrative that is, we need to take everyone's guns.

[00:28:02] Andy: That's right. And if you just think about it, there is a selection bias in this, because if you look at someone who was committed a mass atrocity of some sort, that means they're a disturbed individual. Disturbed individuals are more likely to be prescribed psychiatric drugs. So it could be a chicken and egg thing, that they were given the psychiatric drug because they were disturbed and violent, but then it was misinterpreted later as the psychiatric drug made them violent. Right?

[00:28:32] Luke: Right.

[00:28:33] Andy: So I haven't seen evidence of someone being started on a drug and then having a substantial change in their behavior that they became--

[00:28:43] Luke: Like a Jekyll and Hyde situation. I've been on these pills for a month and now I feel the urge to kill a number of people. That's cool. Yeah. Because you hear these in the alternative media realm, which I think many of us just take, well, if the other side is false, then therefore, by default, the contrary side is true. But you hear these memes every time there's a shooting. It's like, well, they're all on psychiatric medication, therefore that's what's causing it. So that it's much more nuanced, like everything we try to pick apart.

[00:29:12] Andy: Listen, if you just go and walk up to random people on the street, probably eight out of 10 have taken a psychiatric medication in their lifetime, and maybe five out of 10 are taking them presently. Sleeping pills are psychiatric medicines. Think how many people you know who take sleeping pills.

[00:29:30] Luke: Yeah, yeah. So we're at the end of a very strange epoch in the human experience right now on the--

[00:29:41] Andy: I'm not sure we're at the end, but we're definitely in the thick of it.

[00:29:44] Luke: The end of one chapter, at least an area of focus known as the COVID or, as I call it, the Convid era. And I think I first learned of you as being someone who was outspoken about many aspects of it, so I gravitated toward your work, but I don't think before seeing you on some YouTube videos, I was ever aware of the idea that it's possible that as a civilization, we've been misled about the nature of illness, specifically that germs being passed from one person to another as a contagion is maybe as false as some of the other things that we've been led to believe.

[00:30:28] And now the nature of our reality and universe in this realm and the shape of the planet and all sorts of things seem to be quite suspect. At what point did you start to question the narrative that we've all just automatically bought into that if I, say, have the flu and we shake hands and then you rub your nose, then you have the flu? When did that start to fall apart for you?

[00:30:56] Andy: Well, I came up in the medical system and I vaccinated myself and took antibiotics, and it wasn't really until I had been on this path of studying natural healing. And I actually was researching climate change, and in that space, there are a couple of Nobel Prize winners who have criticized the whole global warming narrative from a scientific point of view, and they're quite compelling.

[00:31:29] And one of those, turns out, was Kary Mullis, who won the Nobel Prize for inventing the PCR technique, which is a pretty interesting and powerful technique for research in biology. But he was talking about climate change. And I was searching for his lecture about climate change to show someone that I was having a discussion with.

[00:31:53] And when I searched for that, another video of his came up. It was something like, couldn't find HIV. So I'm like, oh, that's interesting. What's that about? So I listened to it and he told the story about how someone approached him and said PCR could have applications in AIDS, so we'd like to do some collaboration on that, or we encourage you to apply it to that situation.

[00:32:20] So he wanted to learn a bit about AIDS and all the papers that he looked at start off with this premise that HIV caused AIDS. So he said, all right, I'm going to write a paper, a manuscript or a grant proposal, and I want to have the reference, the paper that established where HIV caused AIDS.

[00:32:43] So he started just doing a regular lit search, and he couldn't find it. And he kept searching for months, and could not find the paper. He looked on the various websites that talked about AIDS, like in the CDC and such, could not find any reference which established HIV as the cause.

[00:33:06] So after some time passed by, he bumped into Luc Montagnier, the French virologist who won the Nobel Prize also for discovering HIV, allegedly. And so he went up to Professor Montagnier and said, oh, I'm so glad to find you. I've been searching for the paper that establishes HIV as a cause of AIDS. You must know it since you discovered it. Can you tell me?

[00:33:34] And he told him about a paper that was not a scientific paper and didn't have any experiment that made that establishment. And he was perplexed. He's like, wow, the guy who discovered the virus can't even point me to the paper. And after he thought about this some more, the conclusion he had is that HIV doesn't cause AIDS, because if it did, where's the evidence?

[00:34:01] And I thought this was quite interesting. I only thought this has got to be unique to HIV at the time, and I mentally filed it aside to come back to later. And then come January, February of 2020, when there started to be news reports, people dropping to the ground in Wuhan, China, and--

[00:34:26] Luke: The zombie films we're watching.

[00:34:28] Andy: And I traveled to the West Coast in early February of that year, and I saw all these Americans wearing masks at the airport in San Jose, and I was confused. I was like, what's going on? So I had to start looking into it. And of course it was related to this alleged new viral disease. And I said, all right, I'm going to do what Kary Mullis did for HIV.

[00:34:51] I'm going to find the paper that establishes that there is this virus and that it causes this disease. And I went to the literature and found at this time there was only one paper published, and there was one paper that was in process of being published, but there was an advanced manuscript available to read that wasn't fully edited yet.

[00:35:12] So I looked at those papers and I looked at the experiments and I'm like, these papers don't establish even that this virus exists. And they didn't even purport to show that it caused a disease. These were papers that were just basically stating they discovered this virus, and in there they said it may be the cause of this disease, which is like the flu.

[00:35:42] So I was confused because I'm like, this is weird. They didn't actually do the experiment to discover the virus. They did some other weird experiment in a Petri dish in a laboratory. And I'm like, they didn't follow the scientific method here. There was no control experiment.

[00:36:02] And I was really confused. And then I had to really think about it and put it in context. And I started looking at all other kinds of virus papers. In fact, I even tried to trace every Corona virus paper back to the original paper, which was published in the '60s in a veterinary journal. And I had to enlist the help of a friend whose mother was a librarian who was able to get me a copy of that manuscript.

[00:36:30] And what I found is that, by and large, they did the same bogus experiment in every paper that didn't follow the scientific method and didn't actually find anything resembling a virus in nature. They essentially created things in a laboratory experiment using genetically modified commercial cell cultures and adding a bunch of toxic ingredients. And I was just like, what are they doing here?

[00:37:01] And so this was astonishing and it made me really nervous to talk about this publicly because what I realized I was saying here is that this particular virus that they're alleging is causing a new disease doesn't even exist. It's a made up thing. It's like a man-made laboratory artifact, essentially.

[00:37:26] And I wanted to be sure that I was correct because I didn't want a bunch of people saying, oh, you're an idiot. Look, you missed this little fact here. So when I first put this information out to the public, I had called upon a group of independent journalists who were in this alternative space.

[00:37:50] A lot of them were only talking about a cult type, conspiracy issues, but I needed people to evaluate what I was saying. So I said, well, you all just attend this lecture and you can, afterwards you can have it. You can put it on your channel, edit it any way you want, but I want you to listen to me really critically.

[00:38:12] And I want you to, if I'm saying something that it doesn't make sense or it's not true, confront me on it. Challenge me because I want to know if I'm right or not. And I gave this hour-long scientific lecture, and everyone's just jaw was dropped at the end. There were some questions to clarify some of the things I said, but everyone was just blown away that it just made perfect sense.

[00:38:42] So I put it out there to the world and it resonated with people. And it gave me the energy to keep going. And I continued my research. I looked at many other viruses. I looked at bacteria and other forms of germs and realized that the whole germ theory industry, and really it was a industrial complex because all of the business model of modern Western allopathic medicine is really based around germ theory.

[00:39:18] Even if there's illnesses which don't have germs involved, they still adopt the same warfare type of model using chemical weapons as the treatment. And I began to realize that this whole thing was not true. It's not how nature worked. It was a business model.

[00:39:40] It was a script, a false paradigm that was used for many purposes, but certainly resulted in, one, just misunderstanding of our own health. Made us completely reliant and dependent on the medical system and the sort of, I call the white coated priests, of which I used to be, and completely without any trust, confidence or belief that they can influence their own health.

[00:40:15] Luke: So with the Convid situation specifically, pretty early on in 2020, I interviewed David Icke, whose work I'd been into for a couple of decades. And I was trying to put the pieces together like all of us because it just intuitively didn't ring as true and secondarily, the dictates and the information is coming from the government for whom I have less than zero trust, generally speaking.

[00:40:50] And David Icke's position was there is no virus at all. The whole thing is a total psyop. It's a complete fabrication, which would sound crazy to some, and his work probably does sound crazy to many, but because I was listening to what he had to say and going to his lectures so long ago, even to me earlier on, he sounded crazy.

[00:41:13] Especially when he hit the threshold of the reptilians, I think he lost a lot of us there, but now I'm not so sure. But outside of that, pretty much everything he had been talking about had come true. So I thought, well, yeah, maybe he's right about this one. But it begs the question for me, and I think many other people, okay, so if this thing that they're calling, SARS-CoV-2 or whatever it's called, hasn't been proven to exist following the scientific method as you described, then the question that everyone wants to know is, well, why is everybody getting sick?

[00:41:47] And so that led me into the inquiry, like, I don't know anyone that has died from it. And because the PCR testing is totally fraudulent, even people that think they had it, including me in 2020, I mean, I never really thought that I had it, but I had something. I had a really bad flu or something around that time, so surmised that that was that. I've never taken one of those freaking tests and never will. Thank God.

[00:42:17] I did wear a mask a couple of times on airplanes, and it was so dehumanizing and humiliating because I knew it was ridiculous and wrong. But anyway, I started to question, well, is everyone really getting sick? Where am I getting the information that the hospitals are overflowing and all of this?

[00:42:36] And then I looked at, for example, living in Los Angeles, there are many homeless people. And I thought, I don't know if this was a plague. Wouldn't these homeless people living in this incredibly unsanitary environment, sadly, be keeling over? Wouldn't there be ambulances and body bags and stretchers all over the place if this contagion was really present in the way that it's being described?

[00:43:00] And so over the subsequent months after talking to David Icke about it, I arrived at the same thing, which, of course, pisses many people off if granny has sadly passed away and that person's belief system and indoctrination by the media has imposed the idea upon them that they died from COVID.

[00:43:23] And now that we're-- I don't know that we're not out of the weeds, but at least that's not the thing that's being focused upon now, it seems to me that the whole thing was completely fabricated and there never was such a thing at all. And that they just attributed people dying of all sorts of other causes to that thing, and it conflated the numbers and such to create this panic to, I guess, exert more control and get people to opt into this experimental gene therapy and so on. Where you sit right now, do you think there ever was any such thing as this virus being passed from person to person?

[00:44:00] Andy: Well, it's not just that this virus was never shown to exist in nature. It's every single virus that's alleged to cause a disease. You can look at all the experiments done, and the same experiment's been done every time, and these experiments couldn't possibly show a virus the way that they're done, because you'd have to find it in nature. And they don't look in nature.

[00:44:28] They basically create a man-made simulation in a laboratory, and they can do this all day long. They can essentially take any person with any expression of illness, take fluid or tissue from their body, do this experiment, and they're guaranteed to find something that they could call a virus.

[00:44:55] But the thing is, they're not actually finding anything. In fact, the scientist who invented this experiment, his name was John Enders, and he actually won a Nobel Prize because he was instrumental in manufacturing the polio vaccine. And the technique that he used to manufacture the polio vaccine is exactly the technique that became later, not by his direction, but by other scientists after he won the Nobel prize to give alleged evidence that a virus has been discovered.

[00:45:34] But in the first paper that Enders published with this technique, he actually included a control sample. And it was measles where he took the secretions, the snot from patients with measles, put them in a Petri dish-- didn't look for the virus in the snot at all-- just took whatever was in the snot, which, who knows what's in there, but it's a lot of junk, a lot of chemicals, a lot of cells, bacteria, fungus, human, all kinds of stuff, put it in this cell culture dish, and the cells showed some damage.

[00:46:16] But he also took the snot from someone without measles and put it in the same cell culture, not the same exact one, but a similar one with the same ingredients, and the cells in there also showed damage. And he wrote this in a paper that there were unknown factors causing the cell damage.

[00:46:36] And also wrote that you couldn't learn from what happened in this cell culture simulation. It didn't tell you what happened in an actual measles patient. He wrote that in the conclusion. But those findings were just ignored, and all the subsequent virology papers used this procedure, but never did a control, because they knew the control would also show the evidence that they were saying meant was a virus.

[00:47:05] They had already given up looking directly in the patient for the virus because they tried that in the 1940s for many years and were never able to actually find a particle in person's body that they could say was a virus.

[00:47:26] They just found tons of different particles that were all mixed together because when our cells are damaged and dying, they break into particles, just like we would take out the trash. We put it in trash bags so it doesn't spread out and make a mess. We don't just pile up all our trash on the curb. We put them in a bag inside of a can so it's compartmentalized.

[00:47:48] When our cells die and become trash, they also go into little bags essentially. And those are referred to as exosomes, or they have other names when they're admitted to come from us. And scientists can easily find those directly in patients.

[00:48:08] In fact, there is one study which was really fascinating to me because it was looking at an HIV positive patient that they had a blood test that said they had HIV, and they wanted to see, are there exosomes that occur as a result of the HIV illness? So in other words, the theory was HIV was in the body, it would damage the cells. The cells would then turn into particles, exosomes, and then there might be a particular exosome that is associated with HIV that's unique.

[00:48:48] And in this experiment, they took the blood from this patient and they were able to purify the exosomes out of the blood. And once they had the exosomes directly from the patient by themselves in a test tube, they could say, all right, what's this made of? What's in it?

[00:49:11] And they did that, and they were able to characterize what it was made of and how it was structured. And I'm thinking to myself, if they could do this with the exosomes, couldn't they have also just taken HIV out of the blood, purified it, and then showed it, and showed how it was different from the exosomes, and see what it was made of?

[00:49:31] But they didn't attempt that because they know they would not be able to find it. Because it doesn't actually exist. Now, they have a different reasoning. When I've talked to a virologist, they said the reason they can't find it is because there's not enough of it. And they say they need to grow it in a cell culture, in a laboratory, for there to be enough of it to see.

[00:49:55] But that's a very flawed reasoning because they say it does the same exact thing in a cell culture that it does in the body. And you could say the body is like a cell culture because that's how it makes you sick. It has to attack cells and then make copies of itself and cause that cell to rupture.

[00:50:17] And then all the particles come out and they spread to other cells and then they reproduce in other cells. And as they rupture our cells, they get damaged, and that's the disease. The damage in the lungs, they say with COVID, or the upper airway with HIV, they say it is in the white blood cells that it causes the damage. So if it would be growing in the white blood cells, why do you need to grow it in a culture? Can't you just find it there in the actual source?

[00:50:45] If we wanted to discover a new animal, let's say we heard rumors that there's this frog that has silver stars on its back and we wanted to go find it, we would go to the rainforest, or the jungle, or wherever there were reports of this frog, and we would try to find one.

[00:51:09] We wouldn't go take a bulldozer and scoop out a 10-foot square section of the jungle and chop it up in a tree mulcher and then go mix it with some other animals from the zoo and then look at that and say, look, there's the frog with silver stars. They would just go right to the jungle.

[00:51:41] And if it wasn't there, they would either say, well, we couldn't find it. It's too rare, or it doesn't exist. It was just a rumor. But they tried to do that in virology after the electron microscope was invented and never found that frog. And they pretty much gave up until Enders came up with this manufacturing procedure, won the prize, and then I guess that gave some virologists the idea or the confidence to say, hey, this manufacturing process, it actually shows the virus because we can see the damage to the cells and we see particles.

[00:52:18] There's no way to identify what those particles are or say that they're not from the cell itself, but it's a good story and we can make a lot of money selling vaccines. And notice it was the manufacturing technique of the vaccine that was after the fact used to prove that the virus existed. So it's like we came up with a way to sell something and make a lot of money and then we're going to use the manufacturing process to essentially justify it.

[00:52:49] It's very convenient as a business model to have two birds with one stone. And we know that with the COVID vaccine, that it was the top grossing drug of any class of all history. It made more money than any other drug ever made.

[00:53:09] Luke: Wow. And probably killed more people than any other drug ever made too.

[00:53:14] Andy: Absolutely.

[00:53:16] Luke: That's the funny thing about-- I had to rack my brain to it. Did I know anyone that died of COVID? Definitely not, but I know people that, I don't know if it's causation or correlation, because it's out of my pay grade to determine so, but I do know people personally that died shortly after getting that experimental medication. And I know a number of people very close to me that have brain aneurysms, sudden blood clots, turbo cancer, all of it. And they were fine before that, so you put two and two together.

[00:53:54] Andy: I've witnessed the same phenomenon, and you're right. It's not absolute proof of the causal relationship, but it's so obvious that you cannot deny that is most likely, I mean 99.99% that's what's going on. Because if someone is healthy and they're exposed to this injection, and then within 10 days they suddenly are dead or have a life-threatening illness, and it's not just one anecdotal story, it's hundreds and thousands and tens of thousands and hundreds of thousands over time that have accumulated the same exact pattern, this is good enough proof that we should not take this.

[00:54:41] And looking back at what I said about there not even being a virus that exists, how could this possibly help you? Because it's based on a false premise. But the way that they really manipulated people into believing this was all through the testing because they equated the test with the illness, even if you had no symptoms, this idea of you're an asymptomatic carrier.

[00:55:12] And of course, that means that you can be contagious. And this never existed until AIDS. AIDS was the first time that they would say you're HIV positive, even though you're perfectly healthy. But if you have sex with someone, you can pass that virus and kill them.

[00:55:32] And they even prosecuted people in court, by the way, for attempted murder, just because they had sex with someone and didn't divulge that they were HIV positive. But, fortunately, there were a group of doctors and scientists, including Dr. Nancy Turner Banks, who would volunteer to testify in defense of these poor people and show that there was actually no evidence that HIV caused AIDS.

[00:56:00] So even if they did transfer something, it couldn't be attempted murder and they were able to exonerate a number of defendants who would have essentially had their freedom robbed of them when they did nothing that could cause harm.

[00:56:16] Luke: In the case of HIV&AIDS, if we're dispelling the contagion myth that this virus is being passed from one person to another, I wonder what's the relationship between male to male sex, which is inherently likely to cause more bleeding, and based on that model, an easier transmission of a disease, and intravenous drug users that are sharing needles? It, whatever it was or is, didn't and doesn't seem to affect people outside of those populations, largely.

[00:56:56] Andy: Well, I think if we're going to discuss AIDS, we actually need to look a little bit globally because you're describing some of the populations in the United States, which were initially affected. But if you look in Southern Africa, you see a very different pattern. And in fact, there was a totally different definition and criteria for AIDS in different countries. It's not standardized at all.

[00:57:21] But if you look at, let's just talk about the gay population in San Francisco where it first struck, when they called it the gay plague or gay cancer and look at the lifestyle of those people. Because it's not the fact that they had same sex partners. It's that they lived an extremely hedonistic and toxic lifestyle. So there are some data that show that people had multiple partners every single day. They may have had 1,000 sexual partners in one year.

[00:57:54] So that's not normal human sexual behavior with a long term pair bonding. This is extreme promiscuity and of course, especially with anal intercourse, there is some trauma that occurs because it's not designed for that purpose. And also, even with circumcision, you increase friction, which can cause trauma and irritation to the tissue.

[00:58:22] Basically, you're rubbing an open wound in another person's rectum, which has the waste products of the body that you're trying to get rid of. And if those waste products stay in your body, they would make you sick. That's why you have to get rid of them.

[00:58:40] But in here, because of this extreme behavior and what went along with that was the heavy use of drugs. And that included drugs just like alcohol, and cocaine, and heroin, and things like that, but also drugs specifically for sexual performance. And there was one that was heavily promoted to that community called poppers.

[00:59:02] And it's a form of amyl nitrate, a chemical, and it's very toxic, but it was used to prolong erections. And also, it supposedly relaxes the anal sphincter and makes anal sex easier and more comfortable. And so they were very commonly used. In fact, even at many of the bath houses and other places where gays would go to pick up other men, they sell these things in vending machines and such, and there'd be advertisements around.

[00:59:35] And just prior to this outbreak, there was the invention of a new transplant rejection drug for organ transplantations. And this drug actually allowed kidney transplants to be much more successful in preventing rejection. However, because these drugs were poisonous, some of the transplant recipients got these unusual diseases, but these unusual diseases where they were known about already. They were just rare.

[01:00:09] One of them was Kaposi sarcoma, which is the same type of skin cancer that occurs in AIDS. The other issue that the kidney transplant recipients had was PCP pneumonia or pneumocystis, carinii pneumonia. Now, that is also a condition that popped up in this gay population in San Francisco.

[01:00:31] So there was a good clue there that they were getting the same rare diseases, which were already known about, as these transplant recipients that were taking this immunosuppressive anti rejection medication. It was called azathioprine. And it turns out that it is chemically similar to some antibiotics, sulfa drugs.

[01:00:57] And many people in this lifestyle were taking these antibiotics to prevent them from getting sexually transmitted diseases, which they falsely believe were caused by germs. And the antibiotics, and the poppers, and the recreational drugs, and the extreme amount of sexual partners all together essentially created a very toxic person that manifests these diseases like PCP pneumonia, and tuberculosis, and Kaposi sarcoma, and some other things, and these diseases changed over time, by the way, and also the CDC changed their criteria to include more and more things eventually.

[01:01:43] Actually, you didn't even need to have an HIV test to be diagnosed with AIDS because that test also was meaningless, and it's never been FDA approved, because it's never been validated, just like the COVID test.

[01:01:56] Luke: Oh my God. So that umbrella of different conditions was essentially attributed to AIDS.

[01:02:05] Andy: Yes, this new disease of AIDS was invented and essentially it was an umbrella that includes all these other diseases that already existed that were known about. And so it's like you create it as something new, even though it's just old.

[01:02:23] And if you looked at different populations, like if you looked at the homeless population where they also got sick, they didn't get the same diseases. They didn't get Kaposi sarcoma and PCP pneumonia. They got TB. And we already knew that IV drug abusers and homeless people get TB. So now, it was reclassified as part of AIDS instead of just the regular TB that we know goes with malnourishment and a toxic lifestyle.

[01:02:53] And using dirty needles and sharing needles is not a problem that you pass viruses between each other. It's a problem that you're passing dirt and poison between each other, like the people who are in this IV drug use habit. They do not have good hygiene practices. They do not take care of their health. They don't eat right.

[01:03:19] Many of them are homeless. They might be shooting up in shooting galleries, which are basically condemned buildings that are filled with filth and squalor, and they're putting all of this filth and material right into their veins. So of course, that's why they get ulcers on their skin, and that's why they get sick.

[01:03:39] Luke: I know needle users, friends of mine. I never used needles when I was an addict, thank God, but I have friends that would use toilet water to drop their fix. That was the only water around.

[01:03:54] Andy: Of course, when you're in that state, you don't really care what you're doing as long as you get that high.

[01:04:02] Luke: Yeah, I can attest to that. So there's a prevalent belief by a sect of people now that think that the official narrative of Convid is false, but that there was a bioweapon that was created in Wuhan that's been unleashed on the planet. And even though the official narrative of this virus getting people sick was not true, that that is true.

[01:04:33] And when I started hearing that idea become prevalent, it reminded me of an older conspiracy idea that AIDS had been produced in the same way, and even maybe before that, Lyme disease having escaped from some government lab making bioweapons and things like that.

[01:04:57] Based on the model that you've been creating over the past couple of years, do you see any evidence that any of those three exist even in a manufactured context? Or is the whole thing based on just attributing the illnesses for other things to something that's made up? You know what I'm getting at?

[01:05:25] Andy: Yeah. Yes. I fully understand.

[01:05:26] Luke: Is there a real fake thing even?

[01:05:29] Andy: So if you look at this from a zoom out and look at the big picture and just speculate for a moment, okay, let's say that AIDS and HIV was completely made up. What would the benefits be for the people who made it up? And I think that's where the clue is because there are many benefits.

[01:05:55] So for example, for the scientific field of virology, they were just about out of gas because they had been funded almost entirely by Nixon's war on cancer, looking for viruses that cause cancer. And that funding was up and they didn't make any major discoveries.

[01:06:13] So there was going to be no more grants to find viruses and cancer. So what were they going to do next? How were they going to get their funding? HIV provided that. It became one of the most funded avenues of research because it was considered such a serious problem. So without HIV, all of those scientists would not be able to keep going in their field. They would have to change careers in some way.

[01:06:43] Let's look at the drug companies. So HIV drugs, you take for life. That's a great business model because anytime you have a customer and they keep buying your product for the rest of their life, that is the most money you can get out of them. So it provided a huge benefit to the pharmaceutical industry.

[01:07:06] Let's say that you wanted to decrease the birth rate. Well, HIV provided that because for the first time people were scared of having sex, and they began using condoms as a physical barrier. Condom use went way up. I was coming of sexual maturity in this era and any girlfriend that I had, when we got to the point that we were ready to engage in a sexual relationship, it was always it has to be a condom.

[01:07:43] We have to get an HIV test first, or we can't not use a condom unless we have an HIV test. And this wasn't about pregnancy because the woman was taking birth control pills. This was really the condition of my generation, and you can look and see declining birth rates as a result of this, so it could be looked as a population reduction agenda.

[01:08:07] Now, let's step back from that and say, so there's these big interests, had a lot to gain from this idea of virus causing this disease. So let's say now that there's considerable criticism and the science is disproven or discredited, and the truth is that there's no virus at all, and that AIDS is just a relabeling of some other thing.

[01:08:42] And we could easily prevent it because we could say, all right, stop taking nitrogen poppers, have less sexual partners, stop sharing needles, get sterile needles, etc. We could easily prevent these things. But then the population goes up with more births. The drug company can't sell their drugs. Everybody loses.

[01:09:08] However, if you can keep the idea alive that, even though maybe HIV doesn't cause AIDS, but there's some other virus, maybe it's even man-made, well, that keeps everything else going. Because you need to take drugs to not get sick from the man-made virus. You could still get the man-made virus from having sex with someone, so you can't do that.

[01:09:35] And it keeps the narrative alive, and then it allows them to plan the next fake virus outbreak. Before COVID, they went through a number of false starts, bird flu, swine flu, Zika, etc., etc., Ebola. And people didn't really take any of these things very seriously. They could never get enough impetus to do mass vaccination.

[01:10:01] Like in the swine flu in the '70s, they tried, and people became paralyzed, just a few people and they just took it, they said, you can't sell it anymore. There was never a need for it in the first place. In fact, the Surgeon General for the United States admitted there wasn't even one single case of the swine flu in the whole country when they were rolling out these experimental vaccines. But that was a failure. It got taken off the market. People stopped it. They didn't believe it. They knew no one got sick.

[01:10:32] So they wouldn't be able to ever do this again if people knew that there were no viruses. But if there's a possibility of some scary military-developed weapon, well, that could be even more dangerous. In fact, it should be more dangerous than a natural virus. But here's the thing. It would keep the narrative alive and would keep all those goals and business advantages alive.

[01:11:05] But how can you make an infectious particle in a laboratory when there's no model in nature to copy. How would you even do it? Because there's no biological machinery that does this. You could make a robotic device maybe that can fly around and bore into someone's body and release poisons or start drilling through their tissues and make holes or something, but you'd be able to detect that pretty easily. So there's just no evidence.

[01:11:45] No one has shown that there's a bioweapon virus, just like no one has shown that there's a natural virus. Also, if there was a release of a real biological weapon, if such a thing were possible to make, I would expect there to be real devastation, but there wasn't real devastation.

[01:12:07] There was just the appearance of devastation, like changing the numbers of flu deaths to COVID deaths or recategorizing heart attacks to COVID, or dementia to COVID, or car accidents to COVID. That's what we saw. We did see also hospital and nursing home protocols in various discreet locations killing people.

[01:12:34] We saw people dying of that, but nowhere was there evidence of any kind of biological weapon of any kind. And so this is a very dangerous narrative because it perpetuates the idea that viruses are real and dangerous. Now, I do think there was a weapon of sorts. I wouldn't call it biological. I would call it a chemical weapon, but it was the injections themselves. And we saw the clear evidence of how that harmed and killed people. And so if you want to say there was a weapon of any kind, that's what we're talking about.

[01:13:17] Luke: The one for which we have evidence.

[01:13:18] Andy: We have tons of evidence. But I would say it's not biological. There's no organism in it. It's a chemical soup, and we don't really even know the extent of all the chemicals.

[01:13:28] And there are some brave scientists and microscopists trying to figure that out, and they've maybe identified some things. But we really don't know. And in fact, the way that this was sold under the emergency authorization, rather than actually getting approval, allowed the companies to change ingredients, because it's in development, and without disclosing it.

[01:13:57] Luke: Diabolical. We're just about out of time, but I want to ask you one more thing. So many people listening, including myself will periodically get lab testing done with your functional medicine practitioner, and some of those tests might be a blood test to check your viral load.

[01:14:15] And then you'll see traces of Epstein Barr or this or that, and then be put on a protocol of supplements or in some cases, maybe a pharmaceutical antiviral. If, based on the criteria of accurate and legitimate scientific method, a virus has not been proven to exist ever, what is a blood test that's testing for something like Epstein Barr finding and how are they finding it?

[01:14:45] Andy: So what they do in order to give the appearance that a virus actually exists is that they assume it's there. So they would do these cell culture experiments. They would have someone with this pneumonia type of illness or, in your case, Epstein Barr. So let's say they had chronic fatigue syndrome, which they say might be due to that in part.

[01:15:15] So you have someone with chronic fatigue and then you take their blood and you believe that the Epstein Barr virus is in there. You assume it to be in there. And then you look at other aspects, other things in the blood. And so, for example, you can find little snippets of DNA and RNA in the blood.

[01:15:39] And since you assume there's a virus in there, you don't actually find it or demonstrate it, you just assume it. But you can take these little bits of RNA and DNA and then you would assume that some of them at least must be from this virus that I assume to be there. And then you do some further experiments and you use a computer model and you say, oh, here are the sequences that are from the virus.

[01:16:10] It's completely hypothetical, but you're assuming that it's correct, and then you develop a test to demonstrate those little genetic sequences. And since you assume that those are from that virus, which you never actually found or demonstrated, you then say this test will detect these sequences that are from a virus.

[01:16:37] And that's passed off as a real test for a real virus. Now, the way that you would really do this-- and because there are some tests that actually are accurate, not for viruses, of course, but for other things like for example a pregnancy test. We know a pregnancy test is accurate on most of the time.

[01:16:57] It's not 100%, but it's close. And that is an antibody test. And we know we have antibody tests for viruses too. So what they had to do to figure out if that works is they had to say, oh, we've identified this antibody. We think when this antibody is in the blood or the urine, that means a woman's pregnant, or it's from the pregnancy.

[01:17:25] So all we have to do is see if this antibody is pregnant in women and then wait nine months and see if a baby comes out, and that's what you call the gold standard, because if a baby comes out at the end, they had to be pregnant to begin with. So there's no mistakes there. And if you find the antibody in a woman that no baby comes out of in the next nine months, you'd have to say, oh, that antibody is not correlated with pregnancy.

[01:17:54] We can't use that to measure pregnancy. But if it only is there when they're pregnant, then it could be a good test. So they say, okay, in 99 patients out of 100, the antibody was an accurate predictor of pregnancy. So we could say the error rate of that antibody test is 1%. Now, if we're going to develop a test for a virus, we have to do the same thing.

[01:18:21] So we come up with a marker. It could be an antibody, it could be a sequence of genetic material, it could be an antigen, an actual piece of protein that we think is the virus itself that elicits the antibody response, but we can measure it directly. Any kind of piece or reaction of our body to the thing that could be a candidate to develop a test.

[01:18:46] And it's easier than demonstrating the virus itself. That's why it's convenient to have these tests. You can't look inside a woman's belly very easily. You could cause problems if you do that to see the baby directly. But you can take a little bit of urine and put it on a blotter paper, no problem.

[01:19:04] It's not going to cause any harm, and that's why it's so good to have a test. But with the test for a virus, you'd select this surrogate thing that's easy to measure like an antibody or a genetic sequence, but you'd have to then test for that in people, in 100 people or 1000 people, however many, and then you'd also have to determine that the virus is in those people.

[01:19:33] So you'd have to do the gold standard virology experiment to demonstrate the virus there. Now that is this bogus lab culture experiment that I told you about, which is not accurate. But they don't even use that to validate it.

[01:19:50] Do you know how the CDC confirmed that the PCR test was accurate? They actually used a machine to synthesize the sequences that they assumed were from a virus. Because they couldn't actually get it from a virus to do the experiment, they synthesized it in a machine, and then diluted it to different concentrations and ran the PCR protocol and validated the results compared to the known concentrations of a man-made sequence.

[01:20:28] They didn't test it against the presence of an actual virus. And in order to get FDA approval for any diagnostic test, step one is perform a validation study, which is exactly what I described, where you take the gold standard and the test and you compare the results in the same people and see how much of the time was it correct and how much was an error?

[01:20:56] You can't even apply to the FDA to get a diagnostic test approved until you do that study. And the study actually has to show that it has a low error rate. You can't give something that 80% of the time is wrong and only correct 20% of the time.

[01:21:14] Luke: Or something that you could test a papaya or a monkey.

[01:21:19] Andy: Yes, exactly.

[01:21:21] Luke: With the PCR test, that was hilarious. There are people that run around testing all kinds of things positive.

[01:21:27] Andy: Right. So this is related to actually politics and law as well because in the law in our country and in all countries, really, there is this idea of an emergency. And when there's an emergency, and of course, it's very subjective as to what classifies as an emergency, you can throw all the rights of the people out the window, and you can throw all the protections out the window.

[01:22:01] In fact, even the Supreme Court of the United States, I believe, or definitely the Congress had said that even habeas corpus is suspended during an emergency. And habeas corpus is your right not to be falsely imprisoned. So, in other words, just like with the Patriot Act, you can be falsely imprisoned because of the emergency of the 9/11 terrorist attacks. Even to this day, you can still be imprisoned because of that emergency.

[01:22:30] Luke: Yeah. They never repeal the change.

[01:22:32] Andy: No emergency.

[01:22:33] Luke: Even after emergency subsides.

[01:22:35] Andy: The HIV antibody test was allowed to be sold because of an emergency, and it's still is allowed to be sold because of emergency. It was never even applied for FDA approval because they couldn't do that validation study because they couldn't show the virus.

[01:22:55] So they could never get FDA approval. They wouldn't be able to sell it otherwise. And this is what happened during COVID. It was declared an emergency. So that means now you don't have to actually test the test, the diagnostic test and show that it's accurate. You can just sell it because it's an emergency without it being accurate.

[01:23:17] And the FDA gives a letter. Any company that wanted to sell a test, they would send a request to the FDA, will you authorize us to sell this because of this emergency? And the FDA sends back a letter giving them the authorization. And I've read several of those letters that are published on the FDA website. And right in the letter, it says, we don't really know if this is accurate or not, but you're allowed to sell it anyway.

[01:23:47] Luke: Oh my God.

[01:23:48] Andy: Not in those exact words, but that's what it says, really, in the text right there. And I've read those during my podcast much earlier on. And since it's allowed to be sold, and since everyone is afraid of the emergency, and since everyone has been really indoctrinated their life to trust doctors, to trust the scientific establishment, and even to trust the government-- we may be skeptical, but most people are not skeptical-- that everyone just assumed that the test must be accurate.

[01:24:26] How could they allow it to be used if it's not accurate? But if they read the details, they'd see the emergency allowed that. And anything done under an emergency, we should be very, very cautious that it is likely to be against our own best interest. And there's a long tradition in this nation of that happening.

[01:24:50] And you can go back starting, especially in 1933, and find a number of laws that came into existence only because of emergencies. And this has been perpetuated since that time. And all of these instances of the government stepping on our rights, fooling us, making us think things are beneficial when they're actually harmful is all allowed and justified by these emergencies.

[01:25:23] Luke: Yeah. Make another emergency take more freedom, repeat.

[01:25:29] Andy: That's right. And if you are an unscrupulous businessman, it is a windfall opportunity because it wasn't just the vaccine that was the top grossing drug in history, but all the companies that sold testing kits, that sold personal protective equipment.

[01:25:50] Luke: I wish I had stock in Plexiglas.

[01:25:52] Andy: They raked in money hand over foot.

[01:25:54] Luke: I thought about that when I first started seeing the six feet apart stickers everywhere and Plexiglas just showing up out of nowhere. I thought, man, what are the margins on the circle they're putting on the floor, that sticker?

[01:26:07] Andy: I remember talking to an individual who saw this happening early on and he found some warehouses that had a bunch of masks and gowns in Southeast Asia and he bought as much as he could at dirt cheap prices and then resold it for probably 10 times. In my opinion, this is a very immoral behavior because you're essentially fleecing people at their most vulnerable and taking advantage because it was not a legitimate need.

[01:26:45] We know that this PPE not only did it not provide any benefit, it actually caused harm. And anyone still thinking that mask could help, there are two very important things. One is, and I don't have time to go through all these studies, but there have been many well done scientifically controlled studies trying to pass illnesses like the Spanish flu, gonorrhea, herpes, the common cold from one person to another, and they couldn't do it, because that's not how nature works.

[01:27:20] In other words, there is no contagion of these diseases. Now, there's the clear, definitive evidence that masks didn't work for COVID that no one really can deny because this is the Cochrane Collaborative. And when I was at Duke studying psychiatry, early on, I was told by the faculty that you need to learn about the Cochrane Collaborative because what they do is they take all of the scientific papers on a particular topic that are published and they combine them into one powerful mathematical analysis known as a meta analysis.

[01:28:01] Because in any individual study, they might find something, but it's a small number of people or maybe it was something unique about how the researchers conducted the experiment, even though they tried their best. But when you combine all these studies together, you see, do they all agree with each other, or are they all over the place?

[01:28:22] And it's very, very powerful. And the Cochrane Collaborative specializes in this. So this is really helpful in certain areas of study where you can only find small clinical trials, but when you put them all together, then you have thousands of patients that you can say, did they all follow this trend?

[01:28:43] Because it's hard to do research of that magnitude. It's very expensive. So it's very powerful. And I was told to give this more credence than any other source of information. And just within the last six months, the Cochrane Collaborative published a review on masks to prevent transmission of COVID.

[01:29:05] Luke: Oh, wow.

[01:29:06] Andy: And they found right in there, the definitive source, there was no relationship between masks and people getting sick. So in other words, it didn't help it and it didn't hurt it. It had no effect whatsoever on whether you got sick with COVID, their definition of COVID, whatever that is. But what it really means is that it has no bearing on you being sick. So there's no possible benefit from it.

[01:29:38] Luke: So for some of us, our intuition was spot on.

[01:29:41] Andy: Well, the intuition can be very powerful because, obviously, it obstructs your breathing. You can't breathe as well. In fact, I thought it was quite amusing that in my recent travel, air travel, they started, when they do their little spiel at the beginning of the flight and tell you how to work a seatbelt, they now, when they're talking about the mask, if the oxygen gets low and the mask drop down, they tell you, if that happens, take off your mask so that you can breathe.

[01:30:16] Luke: Oh my God.

[01:30:18] Andy: It's like you have to take off the mask so you can breathe in the situation that's hard to breathe. Well, that means it makes it harder to breathe in all situations. So you're actually obstructing your own breath by doing that.

[01:30:36] Luke: Oh, man. Not to mention all the microplastics and off gassing of the chemicals from which they're made.

[01:30:42] Andy: Well, there are many, many ways that it can be harmful, and you're right. Microplastics are a growing problem. Do you know that in Alzheimer's patients, they find microplastics in their organs? In people with liver failure, they find microplastics in the liver. So there's more and more evidence that these microplastics are actually agents of disease.

[01:31:06] And it makes sense because they just gum things up, they clog stuff up. And much of our body, the function is about flow. We have flow through our lymphatics, our blood vessels. Even within our organs, there are channels of flow, our kidneys, our liver, our heart. Everything is about flow.

[01:31:25] And if we gum it up with these microplastic particles, and largely, they are in the environment because of clothing, most modern clothing is made of plastic fibers. And when you mechanically agitate those fibers in the washing machine, these little microplastic particles come off and they get into the wastewater and they've entered in the natural water supply and you virtually cannot test a sample of water in a natural waterway anywhere in the world without finding microplastics in it.

[01:32:01] So we didn't get into this topic too much of what's really causing disease, but there is just reams of evidence about various types of poisons resulting in all these acute and chronic health conditions that we falsely or the medical establishment falsely attributes to viruses, and bacteria, and germs in general. And it's not until we learn this truth and how to help our bodies get rid of these poisons that we're going to really be able to be truly healthy.

[01:32:37] Luke: You just set up a part two perfectly. So we've discussed here today in a nutshell, what is not causing disease, and of course that begs the question, well, people get sick, so what is? So I'd definitely like to invite you back for a part two. I got a closing question for you, Andy. Who have been three teachers or teachings in general that have influenced your life and your work?

[01:32:58] Andy: Well, there's a wide variety of people I could mention here, so I'll go with your constraint of only picking three. So let me point to Socrates, who basically laid out the Socratic method of autodidactic learning and teaching. And that has really helped me explore the material, science, mathematics, engineering, technology, etc., from a really strong analytical point of view.

[01:33:35] Number two, Neil Kramer, who is my most significant spiritual mentor. And really without his teaching and my hard work on developing myself in a spiritual path, I would not have been able to come out of my allopathic shell and take risks and put myself out there on the public stage to tell the truth.

[01:34:04] And thirdly, let me just give credit to a category of mentors, and these are the pioneering physicians and practitioners who went out there and started using natural healing methods and had amazing success. And I'll point out a few, Jennifer Daniels, Dr. Jennifer Daniels, Dr. Kelly Brogan, and Ann Baroque. And those three had early on very, very strong influence to allow me to see the potential of natural healing, so I'm grateful to all those.

[01:34:47] Luke: Awesome, man. And I'm grateful to you. I've been wanting to chat with you for a long time, so I'm really happy we got to do this. And also sitting in person, sharing photons. It's much more fun to do it this way because I know you live in New York and I live in Texas, so I was waiting. I'm like, I know I'll run into him sometime, and damn it, it happened.

[01:35:04] Andy: No, you're right. There's no substitute for being in someone's presence. Although I realized that you can glean quite a lot about a person from a virtual encounter, but it's just a different experience. And I think you know our discussion would have ended up much differently had we been separated. So thanks for creating this opportunity for us.

[01:35:29] Luke: Right on, brother.


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